C.M. Office : A public authority

**vashisthvivek** · #1 11-10-2007, 11:53 AM

It is surprising to see that some States have not designated PIOs and AA etc for the Offices of the Chief Minister. Therefore, it gets difficult to obtain information from these offices. Moreover, it seems the violation of the provisions of the RTI Act. Since, I intend to file complaints with the respective Information Commissions in this regard, therefore, I want to discuss the issue on this esteemed forum as to whether the Offices of the Chief Ministers and other ministers are Public Authorities under the Act. The reason for non-designating the PIOs etc. in these offices seems to be that in the Rules of business of the States, the o/o C.M. and Minister's offices are not Administrative Departments. No specific work has been alloted to these offices in "Rule of business". However, to me this doesnot seem to be the correct interpretation of Law. The Public Authority is not designated on the basis of the work it is doing. S2(h) of Act provides that any authority or body or institution constituted under the Constitution or bv notification or order issued by the State Government is public authority. Secondly, the organisations funded directely or indirectly by the Government are also PA. Since the salary etc. of the employees posted in the these offices are drawn from the public exchequre, therefore, these offices are P.A. Thirdly, directions are also issued to all departments from these offices, therefore, it cannot be said that these offices do not carry out any work under the rules of business.
Expert opinions of the members are solicited please.

Rama Sharma · #2 11-10-2007, 02:25 PM

I agree with Mr. vashisthvivek that the offices of the Chief Minister and Ministers should be public authorities. The PMO is also a Public Authority, then why can't be the office of CM and other ministers

**maneesh** · #3 11-11-2007, 07:13 AM

Please see definition of Public Authority
http://www.rtiindia.org/forum/glossary-definition6.html
The office if CM is funded by State Fund there fore it will come under Public Authority and thus under RTI

**vashisthvivek** · #4 11-11-2007, 05:41 PM

I think the issue was not clear from my previous post. I agree that the offices of the C.M are funded by the State fund (Kindly see the orginal thread), but the problem is that the office of CM is not separately recognised as department under the Rules of business. Therefore, officers in the CM office pleads that no independent PIOs should be designated in the office of CM and the information with regard to the CM Office should be provided by the PIOs of the other department as each function of CM office has some relation with other departments.

**karira** · #5 11-12-2007, 05:08 PM

The Delhi CM's Office has a PIO and AA. Please see:

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_15092006_4.pdf
http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_31052007_01.pdf

On calling the CM's office in AP, the Chief PRO informed me that the CM's office comes under the General Administration Department (GAD) and applications under RTI can be addressed to the PIO of the GAD who will provide the information related to the CM's office.

Please also bear in mind that most of the CM's have charge of one or more ministries. Therefore the applications under RTI can also be routed through them.

In any case, the definition of PA under the RTI Act has nothing to do with the work alloted to the PA. Further more, do you mean to say that the CM's office is not the holder of any information ? Difficult to believe that....in that case, what are those offices with so much staff doing ? If there are no PIO's in the CM's office, please complain to the relevant SIC's.

**vashisthvivek** · #6 11-12-2007, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by karira

The Delhi CM's Office has a PIO and AA. Please see:

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_15092006_4.pdf
http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_31052007_01.pdf

Further more, do you mean to say that the CM's office is not the holder of any information ? Difficult to believe that....in that case, what are those offices with so much staff doing ? If there are no PIO's in the CM's office, please complain to the relevant SIC's.

In this regard it is submitted that these are not my views but the view of the officers in the CM office in HP. I submitted an application with the PIO of GAD, but he forwarded the same to the PIO of Education Department. The PIO of the Edu Deptt sent back may application to the GAD. However, the GAD again sent back the application to the Education Department. In the absence of clear orders, the applications are being tossed up. Moreover, there is no justification of non-designating PIOs in the CM office.

**colnrkurup** · #7 11-13-2007, 07:05 AM

Why don't you address the application to "The State Public Information Officer, Office of the Hon'ble Chief Minister, HP". In case such an application also undergo the above type of metamorphosis, prefer a first appeal addressed to "AA, C.M's Office" If it does not produce any satisfactory result, proceed with complaint to SIC. This is likely toproduce result.

**vashisthvivek** · #8 11-13-2007, 10:06 AM

Respected Colnrkurp Sir,
No PIO or appellate athority has been designated in the office of Chief Minister. I approached the CM office personally, but since no PIO or AA was designated, the application could not be delivered.

**colnrkurup** · #9 11-13-2007, 05:19 PM

Earlier I had also confronted with similar problem. Please send the application by speed post or Registered post. Instead of putting the application in an envelop, fold it and stapple. Write the address at the blank back of the application. Let it come back undelivered with remarks of the Postal authorities on the reverse of the application itself. Enclose its photostat as evidence. I had succeded . Please try.

**vashisthvivek** · #10 11-14-2007, 07:03 AM

Respected Colonel Sir,
I had sent an email to the CIC, who has replies as under:-
"The office of C.M. is serviced by the Secretariat Administration and the General Administration Deptts. The PIO's of these Deptts. can be approached for seeking any information about the office of C.M. As regards information pertaining to other Deptts.of the State Govt., the PIO's of the concerned Deptt. can be approached. Hence no PIO has been designated in the office of C.M".

**colnrkurup** · #11 11-14-2007, 08:21 AM

I could not follow as to how the CIC enter the field of SIC. Anyway, you have seen that certain States who does not cherish interference of other departments on their own supramacy have PIOs for their CM's office. It is upto the States. I think nothing wrong in trying. Good luck.

**vashisthvivek** · #12 11-14-2007, 09:39 AM

Respected Colonel Sir,
Thanks. In my last post I had abbreviated Chief Information Commissioner as CIC. My remail was replied by the State Chief Information Commissioner, H.P.

**karira** · #13 02-25-2008, 02:14 PM

Please also read the following relevant thread:

http://www.rtiindia.org/forum/2808-c...html#post10695

**colnrkurup** · #14 10-06-2008, 12:48 PM

I think that the Chief Minister's Office has now reconciled the issue. One of my application addressed to the PIO of the CM's Office is seen transferred to the General Administration Department of the Government Secreariat as ruled by the CIC in above post No.10. The GAD has accepted it and has furnished the reply sought for. The issue now stand settled.

**Dr.R.K.D.Goel** · #15 10-07-2008, 12:53 PM

07.10.2008
It is very well cleared and discussed that the C.M. office : is A Public Authority. I don't want to write more on this topic.
I would like to add that the Hon. Prime Minister of India Ofiice declared the PMO as PA and appointed the PIOs and AAs of PMO. Even the PMO Secteriate is a PA and give all the information to an RTI Act 2005 applicant.
Not only this The Hon'ble President of India also is a PA and entertain the RTI Act 2005 applications, having PIOs and AAs.
The Speaker of Parliament is also declared as PA with its PIOs and AAs with full details of RTI Act 2005 on their web site.

Un fortunately the Hon'ble Chief Minister of Gujarat Sri Narendra Modi has not declared his CMO as PA and no detailed RTI Act 2005 is notified on his web site as I stated in other above Constitutional Authorities of India.
Even the Hon'b'le Chief Justice of India declared the Hon'ble Supreme Court as PA with the details of RTI Act 2005 on its web site.

Mr. Narendra Modi, Hon,ble Chief Minister of Gujarat and his admirers are repeatedly saying that the Mr. Narendra Modi is the best administrator of India and he " Don't eat and don't allow others to eat" i.e. he is very very honest politician of India among the all Politiians of all the political Parties of India. But he does't believe in the RTI Act 2005 of its objectives of Transparency and Acconatability of his officer to the Gujarat Public.

Almost after three years Mr. Modi Canceled his GAD circlar dated 14.11.2005 not to give "FILE NOTINGS" The Corrupt Gujarat Buearucrats use to take this circular of GAD not to allow to see even File Notings despite the clear orders of Gujarat State Chief Information Commissioner in several orders / judgments and directives to the Gujarat PIOs and AAs. Even the Gujarat govt. GAD have not canceled its circular dated 14.11.2005 given them by me several CIC orders that the File noting is a part of the File.

This Circular of GAD dated 14.11.2005 is canceled when the Ahmedabad RTI Act Activist filed a petition in Hon'ble Gujarat High Court against this GAD circular of Gujarat Government.

I REQUEST THIS FORUM AND OTHER RTI Act 2005 ACTIVISTS TO WRITE TO Mr. NARENDRA MODI, Hon"ble CHIEF MINISTER OF GUJARAT TO DECLARE ITS CMO A PA AND APPOINT THE PIOs AND AAs OF RTI Act 2005 OF CM AND OTHER MINISTERS AS PER THE ABOVE Hon'ble MADRAS HIGH COURT DIRECTIVES AND THE PROVISIONS OF RTI Act 2005.

Dr.R.K.D.Goel, Vadodara. President oF FORUM OF WHISTLE-BLOWERS OF INDIA.

**colnrkurup** · #16 10-07-2008, 01:44 PM

Dr.Goel,
Mr.Modi's stand to RTI Act is much better when compared to its plight in Kerala. The world outside may not even know this as the media appears scared of the bureaucrates. As evident from the post above, not only having a PIO for Kerala CM's Office is now beyond any stretch of imagination but am not aware of a single statement ever made by this Hon'ble CM on RTI. This state of affairs has resulted in the SIC with total 5 Commissioners dispossing total 7, 6, 3, and 3 Second appeals during May 08, June , July, August 08 respectively. In July and Aug 08, they have dispossed in total 10 (ten) cases (complaints and appeal together). ie., An average of one case per Commissioner per month.The response of CM's Office, to RTI complaints to them is that "the applicant is harrassing honest public servants by misusing RTI Act." Of coursae I had asked them to quote a single incident of any RTI Activists including me ever misusing RTI Act. No reply.

Now tell me ... Mirror! Mirror ! who is .............

**Dr.R.K.D.Goel** · #17 10-07-2008, 10:21 PM

There is no question of coparison between Modi of Gujarat Chief Minister and the Kerala 5 scic. My point was that the Modi should be more Transparent and acountable for implementing the RTI Act 2005 in Gujarat State. There is only one SCIC in Gujarat who is over loaded with the work.
The Kerala SCIC reply that the Applicant are harassing the PIOs is irrevalent. If the RTI aplicant harassing the PIOs of Karela there is provisions to deal with such RTI applicant for which the Karela SCIC have no reply.

Comparison between Gujarat and karela does't arise.

**Dr.R.K.D.Goel** · #18 10-07-2008, 10:27 PM

My point is that the C.M office is A public Authority and the Gujarat CM still not apointed CM office PIOs and AAs which he should do as per RTI Act 2005 provisions that the CMO is also a PA. It is clear.

**vashisthvivek** · #19 10-17-2008, 10:28 AM

I agree. The PIO and AA should be appointed in the CM Office. Like Gujrat, the PIOs have not been appointed in the CM offices in many States including Himachal Pradesh.

**Dr.R.K.D.Goel** · #20 10-17-2008, 11:44 PM

17.10.2008
The CMO is having its staff knon a CM office. The CMO have its Principal Secretary, Secretary to Chief Minister and other staff of the CMO. All these staff getting the pay from the Gujarat Government. CM Gujarat ha its own WEB SITE ; E-MAIL ID ETC.
There is a public fund known as CM funds which is collected from the public donations. The CM funds are used solely by the CM on his disretion to whom to be biven the aid from the CM fumds. These all shows that the CM has own full staff and independent office. THEN WHY SHOULD THE CMO SHOULD NOT HAVE ITS PIOs / FAAs.

We get letters from CMO. Mr Narendra Modi is the first CM having its OWN line Swagat Programme to listen and give replies of public greviences sent to CMO. Recently the CM of Gujarat also started his own web site "narendramodi.org" then why the CM of Gujarat should not have its PIOs / FAAs.

**Dr.R.K.D.Goel** · #21 10-17-2008, 11:52 PM

We all should write indivitual E-mail to Mr. Narendra Modi requesting him to appoint his CMO RTI Act 2005 PIOs / FAAs. His E-mail ID is "cm@gujaratindia.com :mail@narendramodi.org.
I hope on writing indivitualy to Mr. Modi he will respond positively. Modi is public orienred he will respond to the mails he will receive.
One can also registered on his website "www.narendramodi.org"

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