Request photocopies under RTI by Post instead of Personal inspection

[abhi987]

Hi,

I had applied under RTI to the PIO Building Proposal department, Municipal Corporation. I did not receive any reply within 30 days, and so I filed First appeal after 30 days.

Now I received a reply from the appellant authority dated 21/07/08, the cover in which it came bears a date 22/07/08 and I physically received the reply on 26/07/08.

The reply says "

You are requested to take inspection of available papers and locate the documents satisfying your request under reference the zerox copies of these documents will be supplied to you on payment of Rs2/- per page."

" You are requested to take the inspection within 10 days otherwise your applicaion will be treated as closed"

I would not like to go and take a personal inspection but would like to make the payment and receive it by post or courier.

I would greatly appreciate if someone can guide me as to how can I go about it.

SK.

[jps50]

You cannot be forced to carry out inspection. U can write back and ask PIO to mail certified photocopies, provided there is no confusion as to the papers U want. Good luck

[DineshK]

It seems that you have asked copies of many documents and PIO want you select the files you need copies of. If you ask them to send the photocopies without inspections, you may receive so many unwanted photocopies to which you will paying.

[colnrkurup]

Now you are better placed. Please reply the AA with copy to the PIO that " as per the RTI Act, inspection of the documents is not a precondition for geting their copies," and request them to provide copies of all the documents you had requested. Please also inform them that the public authority having failed to provide the information or intimate requirement of additional charges if any within the prescribed period, now it is obligatory on the public authority to provide you the information free of cost as stipulated in Section 7(6) of the Act. Please also appraise them to furnish the information before (give a date) to enable to you file the Second appeal if needs be before (give date). Please ensure that the second appeal is filed before expirey of the prescribed period for second appeal.

[abhi987]

Subject Matter: The base station for the cell tower has been installed in August, 2007 very clearly in the area earmarked as 15% free open space reserved for recreation garden as per the completion plan submitted in the year 1996 by the licenced surveryors and engineers of the builder to the Corporation.

I would like to share with the forum the RTI queries I have filed in this regard:

First query I filed to the PIO was:

"A photocopy of the plan approved by your department for the installation of base station for cell tower in the ground floor of the above mentioned society."

I received following reply from the PIO within 30 days:

"This is to inform you that as per A.E.(Surverys)'s remarks, the proposal of regularisation of antenna / cabin is noted on CTS no:...... address......

However same proposal is yet not approved due to non-compliance of certain conditions as intimated by this office to the concerned architect."

Based on the PIO's above reply I filed a futher query as follows:

"a) A photocopy of the A.E.(Survey)’s remarks as referred to in your reply no.... dated 31/05/2008 under RTI Act, 2005 received by me on 12/06/2008” hereinafter referred to as “the said reply” for the sake of brevity.

b) A photocopy of the proposal for regularization of antenna/cabin as noted on CTS no.... as referred to in the said reply dated 31/05/2008.

c) A photocopy of correspondence by your office intimating the concerned architect citing non compliance of certain conditions as referred to in the said reply dated 31/05/2008.

d) A photocopy of subsequently approved/ regularized plan for installation of base station on ground level after the said reply dated 31/05/2008."

The PIO has not replied to the above four queries and the AA has requested inspection for the same.

The huge structure in the recreation garden area is still standing tall for last one year without any approval from the corporation. Building proposal department of the Corporation approves the plan and Buliding & Factory department takes action if the structure has not been approved by the Building Proposal department.

One can create a structure without any approval and then wait for the regularisaton and approval.

In this case regularisation is not possible because the area is reserved.

SK

[colnrkurup]

Your RTI application is correct. Had things been staight, there was no reason for the PIO in not intimating you the additional charges required to be depositted (It would have been genuinely expensive) under Section 7(3) of the Act. Anyway now they have no choice but to provide you copies of all the documents you had asked, free of charge. Please ensure tht it is not delayed beyond the prescribed period for filing the second appeal.

[abhi987]

I believe that I have asked for only four copies, each copy consisting of maybe 2 to 3 page so a maximum of 10 to 12 pages in all.

1) A.E.Survey's remark may be just one page.

2) Irregularity can be regularised but illegallity cannot be legalised, and in this case putting up a structure in area reserved for recreation is illegal.

i) how can one submit a regularisation proposal for an illegal structure,

ii) so I knew they do not have that proposal document, so the PIO will have to write to me that no such proposal is pending with him,

iii) and so what is the Building & Factory department waiting for, if there is no regularisation proposal pending and that they should go ahead and remove the structure,

iv)and so no pages.

3) Their correspondence with the architect may be just 1 or 2 pages citing the conditions of non-compliance.

4) The department in its previous RTI reply said the proposal is not yet approved and so I asked them to provide a copy if now approved as I knew they will reply to this RTI after a gap of more then 20 days. Again I knew the PIO cannot provide the copy because there is none and so he will have to write to me that the structure is still not regularised.

So I suppose in all they may have to provide me only 4 to 5 pages and additionally write back to me in response to my query in b) saying they do have any regularisation proposal pending and in response to my query in d) the structure is not yet approved after a gap of 20 days.

[colnrkurup]

Just wait for the copies. You should insist on provision of copies free of charge. You could do a lot after studying them. Procedure for demolition of unlawful construction is available in the Municipality/Corporation Rules. Generally past unlawful constructions could be regularised only if those construction if applied for now can be sanctioned as per the existing provisions. You might have opened a pindor's box. Let us wait and see

[abhi987]

PIO did not reply to my query within 30 days and so I filed First Appeal, I thought I recd reply from the FAA, but now I realise that I had infact received reply from the PIO within 5 days of having filed the first appeal.

PIO suggested me to take inspection, and I wrote back to the FAA clarifying that it is not compulsoury to take inspection and let PIO take inspection, locate the documents and provide me with the certified copies and in case a particular document is not available give a proper reason for that.

Thirty days have passed since first appeal and I have not heard from FAA so far. I have started drafting of second appeal. Am I on the right track.

[abhi987]

Please read this along with post no 9

There are two depts in Mumbai Municipality:

1) Building Proposal (BP) which gives the permission.
2) Building & Factory (B & F) which demolishes the structure if BP has not given permission.

I had made online complain through their portal Official Website of Municipal Corporation of Greater Mumbai to B & F department about the same illegal structure for which I had file a RTI query with BP dept seeking info/copies of the permission issued if any.

Apart from filing RTI with BP dept I had also filed RTI query with B & F dept quoting the online complaint number and asking them what action they have taken against the structure.

B & F dept replied to the RTI saying the query pertains to the BP dept (because they cannot take action against the structure unless BP declares the struture illegal) and forwarded the query to BP dept.

Now 35 days have passed and PIO BP dept has not replied to this RTI query too.

Now can I file first appeal to FAA for this query. The question is one has to make a declaration that the same matter is not pending with any Court, Tribunal or authority.

In this case the same matter is pending with the same authority under different query.

One query to sought info about permission granted if any and the other query to sought info what action has been taken on online complaint.

I would appreciate if the members of our forum can guide me on this.

[karira]

Abhi987,

Both your applications are on different subject matter so there will be no problem in filing 2 Second Appeals.

Please follow RTI Rules for Maharashtra during filing of Second Appeal as well as any Maharashtra SIC rules for Second Appeal formats/procedures/fees.

The FAA has 30 days to reply to you, but he can take a additional 15 days (total 30 + 15 = 45 days) provided he gives the reasons in writing. Just wait till that long and also give some allowance for postal delays.

[jiwateshwar]

You are definitely on the right track. I would advice the following, shoot two letters to the FAA,
....1> Let this letter be your first appeal to the second RTI application which you had filed with the Dept B&F and was transferred to BP. Tell him since the application was transferred "IN WHOLE" (not a part alone) under ss6(3) to the PIO of his dept, thus the matter is completely under his jurisdiction. Make the other pleads as usual.

....2> In this letter make the FAA aware of the pending first appeal (the one you filed before BP directly). Tell him that it is fast approaching expiry of time limits specified under ss19(6). Further tell him that you have also filled another first appeal before him (the letter no 1 above) and since both the applications are directly related to each other and the same CPIO is respondent in both, thus you would like them to be taken up together for hearing (clubbed). Tell the FAA that this is the regular conduct of his PIO and that you seek action against him. Ask him to intimate the date of hearing to you at least one week in advance so that you can be personally present there along with your council (just bluff that you have one! lolz). Do state the last dates for holding a hearing regarding the appeal. You would mention two dates, one as per 30 days and the other as per 45 days, and in that making the FAA aware that if does not pass a decision by the 30day date then he has to give a reason in writing for the delay. Also state that if a decision is not made by the 45 day date, then you will file a complaint under ss18 to the CIC/SIC and that the FAA shall be directly liable for its consequences. (You may include a copy of the CIC decision in which the FAA was punished for not holding a hearing. IC Ansari Rulz! By the way do not mention this as an enclosure and don't sign it or anything, lolz)

The FAA is unlikely to respond. As suggested by Sh. Karira, go for your second appeal on completion of 45 days. I would advice you to wait for atleast a minimum of 55 days since filling of first appeal. The RTI Act allows you to file second appeal within a period of 120/135 (not sure about this as FAA has 30+15day time limit, but I would bet on 120 days) days since filing of first appeal.

The request for clubbing the two first appeals is a trick which the FAA might fall for and shall thus get you a quicker hearing on your second 1st appeal too. The FAA is not bound to heed to this request but it is worth the try.

If you are unable to get a decision from FAA wait for expiry of decision time for the second first appeal also and then file a second appeal for both the RTI applications with reference to each other and a request to club them together.

Personally I would prefer a complaint under ss18 more than a appeal. When you make a complaint under ss18
....1> the SIC/CIC have to pass a decision on it and not send the case back to FAA as in case of second appeals which fail to get a decision from FAA.
....2> you can seek compensation for grievances at the hand of FAA and PIO. You would be awarded $$MONEY$$ and the FAA too will be punished.