Departmental enquiry-information under the provisions of RTI

[muralivmohan]

can a delequent employee ask the disciplinary authority or the inquiring authority any information under rti act any information or records for his defence,whether the charge sheeted employee can elicit any information regarding the correspondence made byhim with the disciplinary authority or the enquiry officer during the period of enquiry, even after the closure of the charge sheet.

[ganpat1956]

Dear Mr Murali Mohan, It appears that you have mixed three different questions in a single sentence. I will try to answer them separately.

Originally Posted by muralivmohan

can a delequent employee ask the disciplinary authority or the inquiring authority any information under rti act any information or records for his defence

Under the general principles of natural justice which govern every departmental enquiry, the delinquent has a right to ask for any information or record for the purpose of defending himself. A simple letter to the enquiry officer giving the details of records sought is sufficient and there is no need to resort to the RTI Act. The enquiry officer usually obliges, for fear of the findings of enquiry being set aside by any court or tribunal on grounds of violation of the principles of natural justice.

whether the charge sheeted employee can elicit any information regarding the correspondence made byhim with the disciplinary authority or the enquiry officer during the period of enquiry

Here, I find the query very much generalised. It is not clear what sort of an information a delinquent wants to elicit form the DA or the EO in respect of his own correspondence.

even after the closure of the charge sheet.

A charge sheet gets closed either upon exoneration of an employee or in the event of a punishment being imposed on him. At that stage, the role of an enquiry officer and disciplinary authority ceases to exist in respect of this particular charge sheet and the stage moves to the appellate authority. If an employee aggrieved over the punishment wants to strengthen his appeal using some additional records/documents, he can very well make use of the RTI Act to seek such records.

[kushal]

This thread can also be referred for understanding what Ganpat has said:

'Investigation' not only means Criminal but departmental investigation under RTI.

[ganpat1956]

Thank you Kushal for the timely insertion of that link. It took me a second reading to realise the complete significance of this CIC decision.

[wagh7]

dear mohan,

I think you can ask any information related to enquiry, complaints, decisions, note sheets etc.

ra katkam.

[karira]

Here is a new decision (9 January 2008) by the CIC allowing disclosure of documents in relation to the Departmental Enquiry:

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_09012008_02.pdf

[abhijeet]

We submitted a complaint with some documentary evidence against a Govt. officer. One departmental enquiry was conducted . The Govt officer was given oppourtunity to defend him, but the complainant was not informed at all in course of enquiry. The Special Secretary, who conducted the enquiry accepted all views of the (corrupt) govt. officer , but did not consider any documents submitted by us . Thus the corrupt officer was exonerated from all charges . We got the enquiry report after submission of RTI application and thereafter raised many questions , but the SPIO of that Dept, sent the RTI application to the SPIO of another Department, and we received reply of all our queries in one sentence --" No record is available " and that too after 158 days of submission of the RTI application . The SPIO friendly SIC 'advised' the concerned SPIO ' please remember the time schedule of the RTI related matter in future.' A fresh application was submitted but even after 2nd appeal and reminders thereof , no response received either from SPIO or AA. The Secretary of State Information Commission once again advised them to 'provide their views/comments at the EARLIEST '
And that corrupt Govt. officer had retired by this time !
Would you please comment on this issue and suggest WHAT IS TO BE DONE .

[abhijeet]

One point I had to add that we submitted many complaints/ RTI applications to the Vigilance Commission/ the concerned Govt. department, Public Grievance Cell, Personnel and Administrative Reforms Department and also to the Hon'ble Chief Minister. As per directive of CM's cell, that enquiry was conducted. (only to exonerate the accused from all charges)
The SPIO of that Department sent that "enquiry report " at least 6 times in any RTI application wrt this issue. But did not clarified at all what was the reason of accepting all the views of that corrupt officer ignoring all documentary evidences submitted.

[colnrkurup]

Dear abhijeet,
This is exactly the way things are happening everywhere. In this particular case, it is stage managed by the vested interest allowing the particular delinquent public servant to retire scot free. Honestly speaking, I don't think that in the present system you me and RTI Act will be able to do much in this case unless you clarify as to what do you mean by "WE SUBMITTED". What is the role this "WE" in the system other than "A LAW ABIDING CITYZEN OF INDIA".

Since your reporting appears as done in your capacity as a law abiding cityzen only, your duties and responsibilities ends when you had reported this to the appropriate authority. He has taken action as he deemed fit. You are not part of his admin istrative set up and naturally there is absolutely no requirement on him to report its progress unless you are holding a posdition warranting such reporting.

Of cource you can keep on persuing the case using RTIAct as to "Action taken by the Authorities etc" and keep on chasing. If you have the patient, something is bound to emerge in the process and with that information you can approach the higher authorities. It will be a long drawn process.

[snkmoorthy]

Mr.Murali Mohan, you can certainly ask for any record for the sake of your defense. No enquiry officer would deny if asked in writing. if the enquiry is closed and orders passed, you may apply to the appellate authority and ask for records for your defense. please remember, the principle of natural justice [audi alteram partem] requires that the defendant is given every opportunity to defend himself against the charges made against him. in case you do not get materials from the appellate authority, then you have a strong reason to go the Court.

[jps50]

Why Not Prefer A Pil. Even After Retirement, Govt Officer Can Be Punished For His Wrong Acts During Service.

[adil85]

Originally Posted by karira

Here is a new decision (9 January 2008) by the CIC allowing disclosure of documents in relation to the Departmental Enquiry:

http://cic.gov.in/CIC-Orders/Decision_09012008_02.pdf

hello
U have lovely collections.Please keep me enlightened as I am a junior lawyer and trying to equip myself with employees friendly laws.U know they are ill paid people and can not afford fee hence if RTI works instead of Writ petitions then what is harm? Job or desired result can be obtained in just 10 rupees.It is an employee who can set the system right if he is not frustrated from the system an employee may give more what his superiors give to society.An employee is the machinery of the superiors and as such he should work mentally free.Victimisation should be avoided to harass him otherwise he would reflect the same in his job causing harassment to general public.
adil

[ganpat1956]

Originally Posted by adil85

hello
U have lovely collections.Please keep me enlightened as I am a junior lawyer and trying to equip myself with employees friendly laws.U know they are ill paid people and can not afford fee hence if RTI works instead of Writ petitions then what is harm? .........

Hi adil,

RTI may not be a panacea for ills of all employees. At best you can get only information available on record and that too from govt or govt funded organisations. Sometimes you may be required to go in for a PIL or a Writ to achieve the desired result after collecting the necessary info through RTI.

By the way, I would not like to call the organised employees of govt & PSUs as ill paid. I am myself one among them and I also know the prevailing situation in the unorganised private sector very well. It is only those in the private sector who can neither take recourse to RTI nor can they afford a writ.

I am happy that we have a budding lawyer among us. Please do participate actively in all the discussions.

[colnrkurup]

Dear adil,
Like Mr.Ganapathi has pointed out, government and public sector employees are not at all under-paid when compared to their productive output. An employee who is at the verge of litigation, writ petetion and PIL against his employer may not be at the right track. For a straight forward, hard working honest employee I don't think there is much problem in getting the information he need by walking into the Administrative wing of his office. When he want to dig only the problem comes.

[abhijeet]

As already explained by me, I would like to have necessary views /comments whether the complainant has got the right of obtaining documentary evidences bythe help of which the corrupt officer had been exonerated . Please let me know.

[adil85]

I, believe yes.If the documents can be presented before court and copies of the same can be supplied to the accused,I do not find any reason why they can not be collected through RTI ACt.If some one refuses to show, he should also be taken as the accomplice under the influence of the SPIO.
A government employee has nothing different from his superior officer so far normal living is concerned.Fooding,education of children,electricity and gas bills are almost same.Only the standard of living differs which costs an ordinary employee more.transportation charges are borne by the employee while his bosses avail the Government vehicles.In the state of Bengal and Punjab where people suffered due to partition of India, life for most of the migrant is still pathetic.They lost their houses in East Pakistan or West Punjab and till now have not been able to make their own shelter many could not marry their daughters against hefty Dowry. I am talking about the ordinary public servant and not about the bosses drawing salaries in lakhs.
Let us motivate all of them for a small planned family with better education to their children and we should find out the way for a respectful living for them.Rti ,I am sure will be ably solve their problems as the employees are never given the proper information since the bosses take the RTI as a tool of assault and not as a piece of information.It hurts their ego to provide information to their juniors.Many circulars in Government order is not made known to the employees.For example I have not been able to find out the answer from the Government as to what should be the maximum hours of duty of a police personnel at a stretch? No one is able to answer quoting any rule or law.Can any one answer it with reference to any order or law on this issue?
adl 85

[adil85]

I am sure will ably

[wagh7]

Abhijit ji,

The case and enquiry should be reopened and all factors should be brought on paper. It will be better if you demand re-enquiry and action on corrupt govt.officer, even he retired.

ra katkam

[bahl_ajay]

The department where a friend of mine was working on deputation as Accountant was considering his permanent absorption along with a few other deputationists. As he came to know that some people junior to him were being given a chance ahead of him, he asked some questions regarding the status of the case by way of RTI. This resulted in his immediate transfer to some other office and secondly repatriation to the parent cadre within a month. Moreover, he had to take the false blame of improper conduct in official work as the reason for his repatriation of which he is not aware of till date. Till date the department has failed to give any satisfactory or clear answer to any of his queries under the RTI Act relating to the selection process or charges of improper conduct.Further on being repatriated when he wanted to know the reasons for this action of the department by way of RTI Act as he was never given any adverse remarks or memo. The Pio of the dept. is denying the information first on the grounds that as an inquiry into the complaint of improper conduct in official work is being made, the information called for is exempted from disclosure in terms of clause 8 h of the RTI Act.In his appeal to the AA he had requested that as per the CCS CCA Rules the person against whom the so called inquiry is being initiated should be provided with the relevant information. But the information is being denied on the pretext of clause 8 h of the RTI Act setting aside the rule position as given under Rule 14 of the CCS CCA Rules. The AA has now replied that the departmental enquiry under CCS CCA rules have not yet been instituted against my friend for improper conduct in the official work. And that all the relevant papers showing improper conduct in the performance of his official work have been forwarded to the disciplinary authorities of his parent department for taking suitable action at their end.

Please guide whether one can go to CIC for seeking the information from the department as we want to know the charges leveled against the person in question.