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Thread: Implementation of CIC decision

  1. #1

    Implementation of CIC decision


    Dear Sir,
    The public authorities are avoiding the applications of RTI through variuos means. Specially some officers of BSNL (A Govt of India Enterprises) do not want to supply the informations and deteriorating the information seekers. I am enclosing the proof of deterioration by PIO BSNL. 1.Whenever any organisation declares the CPIO, PIO and APIO then an applicant may submit the application to any of them or not.
    2. Whenever any applicant having employee employer relations then RTI 2005 is disallowing the benefit available due to his employment.



  2. Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    Hello
    1. The application can be submitted to ACPIO or to PIO, the only difference is the time the reply you will get. When submitting to ACPIO, 35 days and directly to PIO; 30 days.
    2. Can you be more specific, do you mean can a employee ask for information under RTI from his employer?

  3. #3

    Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    My question is this that the benefits available to emplyee from employer have been restricted by RTI 2005. In RTI it is written any indian citizen may ask information under RTI and get the information from his own expenditure. In my case I am employee of BSNL and I want to inspect the records as per orders of CIC. In our service rules it is written that I may be allowed TA/DA in case deputed by BSNL. My PIO is saying me to inspect the recorda at various places and on the order of PIO I visit the places I am entitle TA/DA. Even on any kind of enquiry facing by a Govt. servant he is entitle for TA/DA.
    Two problems are being faced by me:-
    1. My PIO unnecessarily deteriorating me for submission the request in view of decision through proper channel.
    2. He don not want actually to inspect the recods so that he is asking time and date from me. Being employment I am unable to say when I may inspect the records because the leave sanctioning authority is also my employer. The records may be inspected in case the PIO want to get inspected the records. Please tell me the provisions available and what I can do in this situation.

  4. #4
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    Col NR Kurup (Retd)
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    Re: Implementation of CIC decision



    Your employer not having detailed you for any duty to fulfill your own requirement, you are not entitled for any TA/DA for inspection of documents you had sought under RTI Act. Your PIO did not order you to go and inspect the documents. On the other hand you had asked for inspection and the PIO had intimated to you only where and when it is available. You are at full liberty in not carrying out the inspection in this case whereas if you had been detailed by your superior officer for inspection of any official duties you are duty bound to obey him. In that case you are entitled for TA/DA Allotment of the date, time and place of availability of the documents for your inspection is the prerogative of the publicauthority/CPIO. Incidentally, the entire issue of allowing use of RTI Act by public servants are under examination. In case the information you need is very important, I suggest, better you avail the existing benefit, and inspect it by availing leave and incurring expenses lest you may miss this opportunity.

  5. Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    Quote Originally Posted by sngupta View Post
    My question is this that the benefits available to emplyee from employer have been restricted by RTI 2005. In RTI it is written any indian citizen may ask information under RTI and get the information from his own expenditure. In my case I am employee of BSNL and I want to inspect the records as per orders of CIC. In our service rules it is written that I may be allowed TA/DA in case deputed by BSNL. My PIO is saying me to inspect the recorda at various places and on the order of PIO I visit the places I am entitle TA/DA. Even on any kind of enquiry facing by a Govt. servant he is entitle for TA/DA.
    When you are invoking the RTI Act as a citizen, it automatically means that like any other citizen, the facility to inspect the records is available to you at your own cost and time. In the instant case you happen to be an employee of BSNL and the PIO happens to a superior officer of your own employer. It does not mean that your PIO is deputing you to inspect the records at various places, because you are not discharging any official work of your employer in that process. Hence there is no scope for you to claim TA/DA for such inspection of documents, since they are not part of your official duties.

    The matter of TA/DA for attending an enquiry proceedings is a totally different issue which is governed by your service regulations/standing orders.
    Defeat is not final when you fall down. It is final when you refuse to get up.

  6. #6

    Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    Mr. Colrkurup view with reagads to, RTI will be for public servant or not is under consideartion. Every public servant is first indian citizen than he is public servant. Actually who is working in services is having more interest to improve the work of department. I want to know by this forum the implementation of CIC decisions comes under which section of RTI 2005. As I know application under RTI, 1st appeal and second appeal provision comes under RTI. The implementation of decision once again comes under civil procedure code. Please say me what is actual position
    Last edited by sngupta; 30-09-07 at 05:31 PM.

  7. Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    Quote Originally Posted by sngupta View Post
    The implementation of decision once again comes under civil procedure code. Please say me what is actual position
    Going through the entire post several times, it is very difficult to understand just exactly what you want to know?

    Q. If its whether the Govt. employees can ask info under RTI?
    Ans Yes, they can. As they are Citizens of India who have been given an opportunity to work for Govt. of Indian under Article 309 of the Constitution.

    Q. Can TA/DA be granted for inspection of documents under RTI?
    Ans. No. As already described by Col. Kurup and Ganpat. TA/DA is applicable only for Govt. Services rendered under various rules like CCS etc. Please check FR/SR Part II which should be available with BSNL.

    Q. When TA/DA allowed for inquiry etc. why not RTI?
    Ans. Yes its true that TA/DA is applicable under CCS(CCA) Rules as well as under various other rules where the Govt. Servant has to appear in court etc. There are certain other conditions too, like the distance involved should be beyond 8 Kms etc. However this clause would not apply to the RTI Act. You have to be very carefull when you involve such rules to help you in your RTI Applications. The moment you make such mistakes, I am you are liable for penal action under various rules which apply to staff members of certain Govt. bodies, which include BSNL.

    Q. Can the PIO ask you to "inspect the records at various places"?
    Ans. Yes and No. Since it is you who need the information, you have to visit the office of the PA to inspect the documents held by it u/s 2(f) & (j). You have to do it at your own cost. However, if the records are with different offices of BSNL, you can ask the CPIO to obtain these records (if not volumous) u/s 5(4) to a particular office, say the nearest Head Office / Branch Office and that you will visit that particular office. You will have to give him sufficient time. Generally a week to fortnight should suffice.

    And lastly, you have not informed us on the CIC decision. You have not told us of the contents and the order issued. Nor have to you intimated whether any deadlines was fixed.

    Keeping member of this list in the dark would only cause you more harm.

    Manoj

  8. #8

    Re: Implementation of CIC decision


    A very easy discussion is there. In my company there is APIO, PIO and CPIO. In the personal hearing I made a mistake I could not ask the representatives to whom they are representing. Actually they were representing PIO but in decision Mr. Ansari used the word CPIO. My problem is this that to whom I may ask to inspect the records. I prepared an application addressing CPIO and submitted same to my immedaite official superior to forward the same to CPIO. The PIO himself directly interacting with me so far in spite of I am giving my all applications to APIO. My application under decision of CIC was not forwarded to CPIO and reply has been made by PIO. No where it is clear to whom is liable to provide the information and inspection the records. You Mr. MPAI advised me to submit the application under section 5(4) to particular office. From this it is not clear to whom I may submit my application. Either it to APIO,PIO,CPIO or Appeallant authority.

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